MICHELE NORRIS, host:
We hear now from a Senate Republican. His name is Mike Lee. He's from Utah. He's a freshman member. He's also a member of the Tea Party caucus.
Senator Lee, thanks so much for being with us.
Senator MIKE LEE (Republican, Utah): Oh, thank you. It's good to be with you.
NORRIS: First, I'm interested in your reaction to the talks breaking down.
Sen. LEE: Well, unfortunately, I'm not surprised. This is something that happens from time to time and this yet another reason why I wish the Senate Democrats had not chosen to table the Cut, Cap and Balance Act that was passed by the House earlier this week on Tuesday and moved through the Senate today. We tabled it without any debate or discussion or opportunity for an amendment. I think that was unfortunate and unwise.
NORRIS: And do you think that that happened because this other proposal offered by the so-called Gang of Six?
Sen. LEE: Yeah. I think it was combination of on the one hand there was a desire and a hope and an expectation that there might be a deal that could be cut with the White House, perhaps based on what the Gang of Six was doing or perhaps just based on Speaker Boehner's negotiations with the president. That coupled with an awareness by the Democrats in the Senate that there was overwhelming public support for the Cut, Cap and Balance Act as revealed by a CNN poll that was announced yesterday showing 66 percent of Americans the concepts underlying the Cut, Cap and Balance Act.
NORRIS: But there's no deal, and the clock is still ticking. We just heard on the program from Representative Chris Van Hollen. He says that without a doubt the country must pay its deals, that the debt ceiling needs to be raised. Republicans, obviously, don't agree with that. So if you don't raise the debt ceiling, what's at stake?
Sen. LEE: Well, Michele, Let me push back on that as hard as I possibly can. Look, that is not the takeaway message from this. So far, the only deal that has moved through Congress is the Cut, Cap and Balance Act that has moved through either House of Congress to raise the debt limit. And I am the sponsor of Cut, Cap and Balance Act in the Senate and I've got 40 some odd co-sponsors. We have yet to have a single legislative proposal reduced to a bill in Congress that would raise the debt limit. We're still waiting. But we Republicans are willing to negotiate. We are willing to address this issue. And right now, we're the only show in town in terms of actual legislation.
NORRIS: Are you also willing to compromise?
Sen. LEE: Absolutely we are. And I told Majority Leader Harry Reid today that there's lots of room for compromise and negotiation within the general parameters
NORRIS: Are you willing to compromise on taxes?
Sen. LEE: We're willing to compromise on revenue, on revenue stabilization, on closing loopholes with an eye toward comprehensive tax reform that will stabilize the revenue base. But as I explained in my book, "The Freedom Agenda," ultimately we have a spending problem. And we're not going to control our deficit or our debt until such time as we constitutional restrict Congress's borrowing authority.
NORRIS: Now, you mentioned a CNN poll. Polls also show that voters are looking to members of both houses to negotiate and to reach some sort of compromise. And that calls for spending cuts and quite possibly an increase of revenue through raising taxes or adjusting rates. The Republicans have been unwilling to talk about raising taxes at all. If you're trying to negotiate and if you're willing to compromise, why not go there? Why is that still a sacred cow even with the threat of a default on the horizon?
Sen. LEE: Well, Michele, remember that just a few years ago when the tables were turned, when we had a Republican president and a Republican senator, not a single U.S. senator from the Democratic Party voted to raise the debt limit. Every one of them, including our current president who was then a U.S. senator, who was then-Senator Barack Obama, refused to vote to raise the debt limit. The fact that you've got most of the Republican senators willing to do that this time, itself, represents a significant compromised position.
But we are willing to compromise further, and we're even willing to compromise when it comes to revenue. But the revenue adjustment needs to be worked out carefully so that, in the president's own words, from what the president said just in 2009, a down economy is the worst possible time to raise taxes.
NORRIS: Would you support the McConnell-Reid proposal that allows the president to raise the debt ceiling independently?
Sen. LEE: No, I would not for the simple reason that it doesn't include any permanent structural spending reform mechanism. The McConnell proposal, as it was introduced to me, amounts to what is it almost a clean debt limit increase.
NORRIS: President Obama said Republicans seem unwilling to say yes to anything. I'd like to give you a chance to respond to that.
Sen. LEE: Hey, that is an absolute, bald-faced lie. Republicans have compromised. The mere fact that we're at the table, the mere fact that we and only we have proposed legislation that would actually raise the debt limit is itself a huge compromise. The president can say he didn't like our bill. The president can say he wants amendments made to it, changes made to it. But for him to say that we have been unwilling to compromise is an absolute lie and he should be ashamed of himself.
NORRIS: Senator Lee, thank you very much for making time for us.
Sen. LEE: Thank you very much. It's good to be with you.
NORRIS: All the best to you.
Sen. LEE: Same to you.
NORRIS: That's Republican Senator Mike Lee from Utah. He's a freshman member. He's also a member of the Senate's Tea Party caucus. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.